Bralles in VIP is a theif!!!

Hi,

Wanted to let everyone know that I highly suggest not doing business with a player named Bralles who is member of VIP guild. Now for those of you who support not doing business with thieves and scammers, please keep in mind there are 3 different guilds: V-I-P & VIP2 & VIP. The member I'm referring to is Bralles in VIP. I have contacted the Guild Leader to see if he/she can try to get my 400 soccer balls back for me, that's even if the guild leader even gives a....

What happened was I traded this guy bread for 11gc per stack because he needed bread. I used my mouse recorder to send these trades to him. Those of you who use mouse recorders are aware that they are not 100% accurate sometimes. Normally, when the mouse recorder messes up the player your trading with will decline any "inaccurate" trades. Well in my case, this didn't happen. I was trading this thief with recorder and recorder clicked on "basic" tab instead of "intermediate" tab and sent a stack of 400 soccer balls instead of 400 bread to the thief for 11gc. I didn't notice until later on in the evening after i logged back on that my balls were missing. Using my investigative skills, and process of elimination, I pinpointed it to Balles...the thief/untrustworthy member of VIP. I mailed him to please check his soccer ball counts and let me know if he has more then he should, and that I pinpointed him as the guy my recorder messed up with while sending trades.

He mailed me back and said "oh thats why I had 400 more soccer balls then i should have had". Sorry, but I sold em already. I said, ok then can you give me the 2k gold coins they are worth, he said I will give you 1 event adventure (100gc value) and 200 gold coins. Thats 300 gold coins vs 2,000 that I'm out. He then removed himself from my friends list saying I was threatening him. His definition of a threat is telling him that if he didnt give them back to me, or the 2k gc value their worth, I would contact his guild leader and let everyone in global know what transpired. He defined that as a threat.

I mailed the guild leader of VIP, and hopefully he/she will do something about this, and hopefully I will get my soccer balls back. Most likely I won't, and most likely I won't even hear back from the guild leader of VIP. If thats the case I know what kind of guild is being ran over there, and what kinds of players are allowed to remain on member list with this kind of character. Balles is a thief, and I wanted to let everyone in the game know about him, and suggest avoiding him at all costs, especially if you use a mouse recorder to send trades. He is untrustworthy and I refuse to do business with someone like himself. If I was a guild leader and had a member with a character like his, I would immediately boot him from my guild and find a more trustworthy characteristic player to take his spot. Again, the actions of the guild leader after reading my mail will define what type of guild is being ran over there.

For those of you who read this far, and may have fallen asleep by this point, let me remind you why i started this thread.....BALLES FROM VIP IS A THIEF!!!!!!

Thanks for listening....and you've been warned!

Disagree with pretty much every conclusion you've drawn, but just to help you out a bit ... If you say, "If you don't do XXX, then I'll YYY" that's pretty much the spot-on definition of threatening. Just wanted to help you with that, since you seemed unclear on why he thought you were threatening him. I'd define that as a threat as well. I have a friend who's traded heavily with Bralles over the last few days, and his experience has been very positive.

I can appreciate that you're unhappy about the loss of your soccer balls, but maybe next time you shouldn't give them away. And certainly next time, you shouldn't accuse someone of being a thief for accepting something you gave them. That's kinda tacky.

I'd say he was nice enough to try & make it right for you as much as he did. It's a shame you've now launched this attack on his character, but perhaps some other people will step up & share their experiences with him to help balance it out.

Wow really .. your taking Bralles side? when he even admitted to having the 400 soccer balls? The guy who makes excuses why he's being a thief and blames the victim is exactly the type of behavior you expect from a thief .. accident or not you know that was not the intended trade. If someone gets money from the bank on accident deposited to there account and they spend it they go to jail. Just as the guy that just happened to. Making it right would mean he gave king all the money he received from selling the soccer balls and not some token crap like an adventure and 200g. He's made my ignore list.

Depending on the amount of time that elapsed, I'd be extremely hard-pressed to compensate someone for this type of mistake, but I'd try to offer what I could. So sure, I'm taking Bralles' side in this. People come in here all spun up about whatever and spout whatever they want, and it's just crap. Sorry you had a bad experience with the guy, and maybe that warrants your inclusion of him on the Bad Traders thread. But a thief? No.

I didn't read in OP's post where Bralles made any excuses for anything. He simply said he didn't have the money that OP wanted, but offered something else instead. Absolutely of lesser value. And the bank example doesn't work, as it's extremely unlikely you'd go to jail. You'd make restitution to the bank, and probably not even for the full value of the $ you'd spent. That's reality. Coincidentally, that's exactly what Bralles did.

And finally, look at it this way. OP is out 400 soccer balls, 1 adventure worth 100g, and 200g in coins. He could have been out "only" 400 soccer balls. So maybe he's learned a lesson that the next time HIS mistake causes him some loss, he can mitigate the damage by accepting what's offered, or he can shoot his mouth off in the forum and try to trash someone's reputation. Not sure which makes OP happier, but I'd rather have the adv & coins. The soccer balls can be more easily replaced than negative opinions of OP's character.

He's not a thief its your fault for being lazy and using a mouse recorder. Sometimes technology isn't always a good thing so don't be lazy and use buggy programs and then blame the other guy, because everyone on this game is playing for the advance of them and their guild and is not looking out for anyone other than their guild and themselves so if you don't want mistakes to be made do it yourself and don't blame someone else because you feel stupid for making such a big mistake.

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Originally Posted by Hobknocker

I didn't read in OP's post where Bralles made any excuses for anything. He simply said he didn't have the money that OP wanted, but offered something else instead. Absolutely of lesser value. And the bank example doesn't work, as it's extremely unlikely you'd go to jail. You'd make restitution to the bank, and probably not even for the full value of the $ you'd spent. That's reality. Coincidentally, that's exactly what Bralles did.

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Well you should go and represent this guy then.. cause pretty sure he's going to jail lol..

http://www.phillyburbs.com/news/loca...b.html?photo=0

Bralles didn't do anything .. he offered crap to make himself feel a little better when he most certainly still had alot more gold than that and soccer balls. It had only been a day and besides that is not even the point.. If i saw 400 soccerballs when I was paying for 400 bread the first thing any "honest" person does is ask the other person did you make a mistake.. Do you want this back? It's incredible King didn't do anything but send a mistaken trade and everyone is on Bralles side. I would do exactly the same as King and make sure everyone knows who this guy is like any other gem scammer.. This whole bad trader post is for exactly this type of person. He took more in one trade then most gem scammers get total. It doesn't even matter to me if it was a mistake or not on king's fault. It's entirely all on Bralles.

In fact, a more honest person would have immediately sent them back without asking if it were a mistake. Which it so obviously was.
To steal by the omission of the application of honesty is still thievery on a subtle level.
I am not judging since I follow the law of karma.

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Originally Posted by Lord_Striker

Well you should go and represent this guy then.. cause pretty sure he's going to jail lol.

http://www.phillyburbs.com/news/loca...b.html?photo=0

Bralles didn't do anything .. he offered crap to make himself feel a little better when he most certainly still had alot more gold than that and soccer balls. It had only been a day and besides that is not even the point.. If i saw 400 soccerballs when I was paying for 400 bread the first thing any "honest" person does is ask the other person did you make a mistake.. Do you want this back? It's incredible King didn't do anything but send a mistaken trade and everyone is on Bralles side. I would do exactly the same as King and make sure everyone knows who this guy is like any other gem scammer.. This whole bad trader post is for exactly this type of person. He took more in one trade then most gem scammers get total. It doesn't even matter to me if it was a mistake or not on king's fault. It's entirely all on Bralles.

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He sent trades to him notifying him in advance that some trades may come out wrong, please check each trade and decline the incorrect ones as a disclaimer.

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We don't know that's true. OP never said he did this. You're adding this to make your story more convincing.

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Within a few hours, ...

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Again, you're adding "facts" that support your side. OP wasn't very specific about elapsed time, but my sense was that 6, 8 or maybe more hours elapsed.

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... it was discovered that his sb went missing, went back and asked Bralles who confirmed that he knowingly received them and kept it for personal gains. Immediately sold the balls, within a time frame of under 12 hours and not once at any time tried to compensate or return them.

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Mostly true here, though we don't know whether Bralles "Immediately sold the balls" as you're indicating. The "not once at any time tried to compensate" is absolutely incorrect though, as OP himself documented Bralles' attempt to compensate. OP wasn't happy with the offer though.

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When Call-Me-King approached him diplomatically

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Hmmm, maybe it was diplomatically, maybe it wasn't. I wasn't privvy to the conversation. But people that run into the forums and post rants about how they've been mistreated don't generally earn the benefit of the doubt from me with respect to their diplomacy skills. Titanxviii or whatever his name was would be a prime example.

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, he says that he sold the balls, and don't have the money and will give him 200coins and an adventure to essentially "go away". After a civil conversation and his refusal to compensate now or moving forward, he removes Call-Me-King from his friend list and goes bragging about it.

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Again, you're adding colorization to the situation to support your side. Why is that? And again, you're intentionally ignoring facts. We don't know anything about the nature of the conversation. Bralles didn't refuse to compensate now, he simply offered something that OP (and others) felt inadequate for OP's loss. And "... goes bragging about it." Where did THAT come from? Not from OP's post.

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I don't see how anyone can take his side. Perhaps you misread or understood the situation here Hob?

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I think it's less about me misreading the situation and more about either a) you have access to information I don't, or b) you've fabricated a whole backstory to this incident from thin air and are using that backstory to help you decide what happened. As near as I can tell, you've introduced six "facts" into this tale that are absolutely missing from OP's post. And maybe I've misread the situation? I'm not even sure we're reading the SAME situation.

The response below was posted BEFORE you edited your post and changed key elements that I based my reply upon. I'm not continuing to play this game. I'm leaving my post as-is, and exiting from the conversation.

Thank you for the additional details. They make me even more confident that OP's behavior is woefully inappropriate. Speaking for myself, when I'm busy making & accepting trades, I often proceed at a pace that makes it impossible for me to note who sent exactly what. So I don't hold Bralles responsible for not noticing immediately that there was a accidental trade in the midst of some number of perfectly valid ones. Heck, my muscle memory for trade accepting is sufficiently ingrained that I can carry on eye-to-eye conversations with people while accepting trades. Additionally, even if you happened to notice that one trade looked "wrong" it's possible to just click the Accept button quickly enough that you wouldn't register the specificity of the "wrongness."

Be that as it may, what you're now telling us is that after OP approached Bralles with the facts, Bralles attempted to make restitution with the value he received for the goods, and OP rejected that offer. Further, OP himself stated that he then threatened Bralles, at which point Bralles removed OP from friends list. I would do the exact same thing in Bralles' position.

If you mistakenly give me the Hope diamond, and I sell it for $23, I'm not giving you millions of dollars in compensation for it. At best, you'll get an apology and $23. if you then begin to threaten me with more "dire" consequences if I don't pony up the millions you believe you deserve, the apology, and the $23 will be retracted. If you then come into a public place & shout about how I'm a thief for not giving you the millions you felt you were owed, I hope someone points out the foolishness of your actions.

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Originally Posted by Hobknocker

Titanxviii or whatever his name was would be a prime example.

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You're **** Skippy!!!!

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Originally Posted by Hobknocker

But people that run into the forums and post rants about how they've been mistreated don't generally earn the benefit of the doubt from me with respect to their diplomacy skills.

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What kind of diplomacy skills can you have in a game when all a thief has to do is type /ignoreadd and disappear.

I do believe that's how one settles things. When someone steals from you, you a.) take care of situation yourself, which usually doesn't turn out well for you. or b.) call the police and the courts (public) take care of it. Well since none of that is gonna happen and BB isn't gonna do anything in this case all you have left is to make sure everyone else knows not to deal with the guy. Cause that's the whole reason bad traders / buffers post was created.

So you don't give any of those people that post to the bad traders / buffers the benefit of the doubt? They just made it up? For people who don't pay $ for the game gold is **** hard to come by especially leading up to lvl 40's.. That might of been every penny he spent trying to get enough for 1 friary.

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Originally Posted by Hobknocker

Bralles didn't refuse to compensate now, he simply offered something that OP (and others) felt inadequate for OP's loss.

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I guess it will take you getting taken for a large enough amount that it 'matters' to you and see where you go. What else are you suppose to do to take care of it if the guy is obviously being an **** (fill in any word you like). Offering pennies for dollars you stolen just hours before is not even beginning to offer compensation. It would just piss me off even more as it would you. If i stole $1000 dollars from you and said oh sorry I just spent it all having a great time last night.. here's $10 dollars.. be happy now.

I can't even think of a good thing I could say about Bralles right now even if he was my best friend in the whole game. I wouldn't even send gold first to buy gem items cause I was afraid of losing 150 gold that took me forever to make in the beginning.

This has become quite dramatic
http://mindset.yoursabbatical.com/fi...Drama_2_23.jpg

having traded with Call-Me-King multiple times even on the day his soccor balls went missing i was also sent the mail he sent around asking if anyone had received his soccor balls from a "bad trade" from his mouse recorder. it was not me as we know who received them but i have received bad trades from his mouse recorder and being an honest person i declined these and informed him of his mistake. i know it happens even if you aren't using a mouse recorder and it is reasonable to expect someone to check your trades after you've specifically asked him to (which Call-Me-King in fact does as i have experienced first hand) and even if Bralles had been blindly accepting when he then later noticed he had 400 extra soccor balls wouldn't he then possibly think that he got them from a "bad trade" from Call-Me-King's mouse recorder earlier in the day? i think so as he was notified it may happen previously. i think it is blankly ridiculous to assume that Bralles deserves defending in this case regardless of his previous track record, is it not even slightly suspicious that he managed to sell 400 soccor balls AND spend all but 200gc of it in a matter of hours without considering where the balls came from?

1st off, thank you to everybody who understands why i started this thread and its intent. Appreciate the support :) Secondly, @ Hobknocker, who the heck are you? Is your name Balles? No it's not. So do yourself a favor and keep your opinions and your multi quote abilities out of my business. I've read your replies about all the scammers/dishonest player threads on this forum and all you do is stand up for these people or belittle the people who mention the dishonest behavior on the forum. All we can do is post on forum and at least inform others of our situations that some players have experienced. When doing so, we don't need to ask your permission or follow your guidelines when doing so. So next time you run into a thread that you don't fully support, regarding scammers/thieves/dishonest players, do us all a favor and keep your opinions to yourself! Nobody cares what you have to say, yet on the otherhand some may care what i have to say about this Balles guy incase they end up doing business with the guy, especially if they are using a Mouse Recorder. I'm not even going to start to explain myself for my original post because I don't have to. All I'm going to say is your "replies" are as meaningless as your "opinions". Find someone else's thread to belittle and display your ignorance.

My objective has been fulfilled, which was to notify others of this guys dishonest behavior.

Im not siding with either, I have ppl who have used the mouse recorder with me and if I got any wonky trades I just simply declined. But a few times I have gotten lazy and just spammed the accept button and whether or not I lost or they lost I haven't paid attention. Mainly when it's about time for me to be heading to work. I try not to make to many trades around then because I much prefer to babysit my trades as you can never fully trust what some people are sending you. However A+ to the OP for looking to be just about as big of a jack wagon as the intended thief. If I lost something due to my own laziness, impatience, or whatever you want to call it, I don't come cry to forums about it. I cut my losses and try to save face and move on. So while I'm not taking sides...I think both parties are to blame. Maybe this guy isn't a scammer or a bag guy totally but maybe he's a tad less than honest. Maybe he wouldn't have screwed you out of soccer balls if you would have never given him the chance in the first place. /shrug

Perhaps the OP was simply trying to shame the guy into stepping up to do the right thing?

anyone that is defending this guy, would do the same thing, and lacks moral fiber. this game is a microcosem of society, most people are honest and hard working, but there are some who arnt. This situation is the same as u being at the grocery store, and u notice the person in front of you drop there wallet, do u tell them, or pick it up yourself? There are some in the world that pick it up, and steel it. (and noone would argue that that is steeling, unless u have no morals) This is the same situation, it is dishonest, and that is a fact.

Judgy much?

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Originally Posted by torakmata

anyone that is defending this guy, would do the same thing, and lacks moral fiber. this game is a microcosem of society, most people are honest and hard working, but there are some who arnt. This situation is the same as u being at the grocery store, and u notice the person in front of you drop there wallet, do u tell them, or pick it up yourself? There are some in the world that pick it up, and steel it. (and noone would argue that that is steeling, unless u have no morals) This is the same situation, it is dishonest, and that is a fact.

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I don't think torakmata was being judgmental, just using an analogy that most people could understand. At the end of the day Balles was dishonest.

Though it irritates me to do so, I come down on both sides of the issue. I agree with an earlier post, I forget whose, and say that you are both to blame.

Bralles is an untrustworthy player, and should be traded with VERY carefully, though I wouldnt necessarily call him a "thief". He would be a thief if he hacked your game account and stole the Soccer Balls from you. Here he just took advantage of an obviously incorrect trade, and the recompense offered was laughable. As far as that goes, Hobknocker is right AND wrong as well. You ARE out the 200 gc's and Adventure (which would have been something at least), but accepting the offer would have negated any moral high ground you hold and expressed your agreement in Bralles terrible offer. Later if for some reason Support or BlueByte became involved in the situation, though highly unlikely, they would have said "Well, restitution was offered and accepted. Case closed."

However, Call-Me-King while I do have some sympathy for you (I try to put myself in others shoes before I comment or pass personal judgement on a situation), it isnt much, lol. I can honestly say this EXACT situation would NEVER happen to me, because I would NEVER use a Mouse Recorder to make my trades for me. When I first read this thread and got to the part where you said "I was using a Mouse-Recorder to do my trades for me....." I thought "Well this CANT POSSIBLY end well". I understand that many players do use them and can see the advantage in it, but it only takes one false step and all the time and gain youve established by using it has been for naught and this thread proves my point and fully convinces me not to use them.

I will thank you for letting all of us know about your experience with him, and sincerely hope things do turn out better for you in the end, though I wouldnt get my hopes up.

Here here on that call-me-king. I posted my very first comment on the forum with a simple question asking if anyone knew when moving buildings would become available. When knobsucker oops i mean hobknocker replies with his jerk off comment telling me to open my eyes and read the dev diary. Sorry that im more interested in playing the game instead of reading everything that comes up on the forum. So please keep posting about the people ripping others off, so that at least some of us can avoid them. He probably sticks up for the scam artists cause he is one himself.

FIRST OF ALL THAT IS NOT WHAT VIP IS ABOUT i HAVE VIP2 AND IF ANYONE SCAMS IN THAT GUILD THEY ARE IMMEDIATLY KICKED AND SECOND THE GUILD LEADER OF VIP IS UNACTIVE THATS WHY ANYONE THAT WAS ACTIVE LEFT AND SOME ARE STILL HOLDING OUT HOPE BECUASE THE GUILD IS ABSOLUTLY POSOTIVELY UNACTIVE. AND I DONT KNOW ABOU V-I-P THEY ARE NOT PART OF US. I DONT LIKE THAT YOU CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT SINCE YOU WERE SCAMMED BY ONE MEMBER in VIP DOESENT MEAN THAT THE REST OF THE GUILD DOES IT, AND SAME WITH VIP2 JUST BECAUSE SOMEONE IN VIP SCAMMED YOU DOEA NOT MEAN THAT YOU CAN SAY VIP2 IS A SCAMMING GUILD LOOK AT OUR GUILD PAGE IT CLEARLY STATE NO SCAMMING IF CAUGHT SCAMMING YOU WILL BE KICKED. i UNDERSTAND WHY YOUR MAD ABOUT BRALLES SHE DID SOMTHING WRONG BUT YOU CANT GO AND OUT THE BALME ON HER/HIS GUILD AND THIER BROTHER GUILD.

@evfarden

Huh? First off, I never said since Bralles is a dishonest thief, that the rest of VIP must be the same way. On top of that, now i find out the reason i didn't hear anything back from VIP leader is because leader is inactive as the rest of guild is, except for a couple members, one who happens to be dishonest, and a thief. On top of that, your putting words into my mouth saying I said since Bralles from VIP is a dishonest thief, members in VIP2 must be the same. I'm sorry if my OP was hard for you to understand, but you are WAY off track. I never said anything about other members in VIP, I never said anything about VIP2 nor its members, and I am now informed leader of VIP is inactive, guild is left open with nobody running it, all active players left, except a dishonest member named Bralles and your sticking up for this "brother guild"? Really? Get your facts straight before you go accusing me of something I never did nor said. VIP is no concern of your, you are running VIP2 so stick with that. For the life of me, I have no clue what you are saying in your above post nor do I care because your entire post has NOTHING to do with my OP.

Let me recap for you so you can understand why i feel that way:

1) You "have VIP2", not "VIP"
2) Guild Leader of VIP is inactive, entire guild is dead except a few players remaining, 1 being a dishonest thief name Bralles.
3) In your own words, " THE GUILD IS ABSOLUTLY POSOTIVELY UNACTIVE " enough said.
4) Also in your own words, "I DONT LIKE THAT YOU CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT SINCE YOU WERE SCAMMED BY ONE MEMBER in VIP DOESENT MEAN THAT THE REST OF THE GUILD DOES IT", I never said that
5) Also in your own words, "AND SAME WITH VIP2 JUST BECAUSE SOMEONE IN VIP SCAMMED YOU DOEA NOT MEAN THAT YOU CAN SAY VIP2 IS A SCAMMING GUILD", I never said that
6) Also in your own words, "i UNDERSTAND WHY YOUR MAD ABOUT BRALLES SHE DID SOMTHING WRONG" thanks for understanding, but its not your concern. Its the guild leader of VIP's concern. But oh ya, your "brother guild" has no leader and its inactive!
7) Also in your own words, "YOU CANT GO AND OUT THE BALME ON HER/HIS GUILD AND THIER BROTHER GUILD" nor did i say or do this. I blame Bralles, and I contacted a guild leader who is not playing the game anymore, yet left guild open for someone like Bralles to be dishonest and a thief. For this i do blame the guild leader just as much as I do Bralles.

Now, why did you reply to my thread here and mail me in-game? Please don't do either. If I'm gna hear from someone about this I want it to be the guild leader of the guild this dishonest player is in, which is VIP, not VIP2.

Bralles was in global chat 2 days ago, guess what he/she was doing? Selling soccer balls! One of my friends commented: you need to give those soccer balls to Call-Me-King for free. Bralles' reply: LOL

This is the type of player left in your "brother guild" with no guild leader, giving a DEAD guild a bad rep, yet your implying what? "THAT IS NOT WHAT VIP IS ABOUT" Could have fooled me! I suggest worrying about your own guild, not your "brother guild" which is obviously dead that has an inactive guild leader who left guild open to have a home for a scumbag like Bralles!

What part of, Bralles is a dishonest thief, and its best to avoid interaction with him/her is so hard for ppl to understand??
Thanks for your time!

You are right i did not interrperet that right im sorry

np, apology accepted.

scammed for someone called woppop in vip3

and how did that happen or did you tell the guild leader

and call me king before i left VIP to go to VIP2 i entered bralles into the guild so if you are going to blame someone blame me

I am not going to go into all the drama that was mentioned here. I saw several posts by "people" were they said one thing then later on said they did not say it. But you can still go back and read that they did.

So the moral of the story is this kids. Do not use unsanctioned assist programs with out accepting the FULL risk and responsibility for YOUR actions.

look i'm sure bralles may have been near questioning into something but didn't have a question for such instincts so it is none of bralles fault nor kings fault, but the recorders fault because the problem could have been bralles not questioning where he got it, no offense to him but maybe he was a bit inconsiderate. I tend to recieve a huge number of free adventures, i got 3 nords for free in the past week. I asked the person who gave them to me for free if it was a mistake and the person said for me to keep them and the person said he owes me still a lot. So the moral is whenever you get something for free, ask the person who sent it if it was a mistake.

agreed

Locking this thread.