Gold Depos in the new Trade System

Anyone else irritated, annoyed, vexed, and generally ****** off at the lack of Gold Depos at non-extortionate prices since the new Trade System came out?? When it was first released everyone went crazy on prices, and we all thought "Ah well, it'll calm down once everyone realizes no one is going to pay these asinine prices for resources and Gem Items" But, here we are months later and I can't scroll through the Trade window without literally laughing out loud at the amounts some players want for certain items. The worst of which HAS to be Gold Depos. I routinely see them listed at 350-375 for a 500 Depo, its only possible to make 500 Coins on a 500 Depo!! And even that is only if you are able to keep it Buffed constantly for the entire 500 Ore, which anyone can tell you isn't worth the trouble. Now I know as soon as some of you read this you'll say "Well I keep mine Buffed 24/7" I didn't say it was impossible, just improbable and difficult for those of us with real lives outside of a videogame.

I think a lot of this is caused by the fact that as buyers we aren't able to list them for purchase, so we are dependent on other players listing them for sale, and of course as seller's they want as much as possible for every sale. So as buyer's we can either bite the bullet and pay the ridiculous prices for which they are listed, or keep them Level-5 Gold Mines sleeping in the hopes that one day we come across a nice guy selling them for sane amounts that don't make us feel like our Gold Coin "Piggy-bank" has been sexually assaulted. The same goes for Wheat, Fish, Meat, and all the other Depos. We can only get them if we are willing to pay the prices listed in a seller's market. This is next to impossible for free players to keep up with.

Now I'm NOT a free player that's just here to gripe about how "unfairly" I'm being treated. I have spent a considerable sum on this game, as anyone of my friends or Guildmates could tell you, and happily so. But that in itself should tell you something, I am perfectly willing and able to buy my own Parrots with Gems and do so regularly. But even I can tell you that this has GOT to change B.B. When prices keep going up and up many players will just stop buying them from the TO and tear down their Mines. I have several friends that have done so already.Then the other players that have been spending their real life money on Parrots and other Depos to sell in the TO will stop buying them from the Merchant to resell and then you've dried up yet another source of income for your Company, and that can't be good for the new "upcoming" PvP and Science updates that we've been hearing about for over a year now :o

Come on Blue Byte, help us out here. Give us something to work with....please??

- VC

I personally will not spend anymore than 300gc for a 500 gold ore depot. Any more than that and the profit margin really starts to shrink.

Here's a spreadsheet I made to show the costs of turning a 500 gold depot into 500 gold coins...

As you can see from the calculations, assuming only 1 gold mine, 1 smelter and 1 coinage...all 3 at level 1...it would cost you 167 gold coins to turn a 500 gold depot into 500 gold coins. So in that scenario if you pay anymore than 333 gold coins for the depo you are losing money.

The cost drops some with higher level buildings, such as level 4 or level 5 which incur costs of 72 gold coins for production.

If you have more than 1 of each building you could assume that the costs go up but this would not be the case. 2 buildings would require twice the baskets but would also require half the time, so the end cost is the same.

Edit: lol, I did all that work and I forgot to mention...yes I agree with you, and I think one partial solution is to allow buyers to put up a request for a gold ore deposit at the prices they are willing to pay. This is not a perfect solution, but it's a start.

A real solution would be to educate everyone on how much it costs to produce those gold coins.

Also it should be noted that there is a gc to gem ratio that is pretty much the accepted norm for buying gem items.

The current gc to gem ratio is about 3gc=1gem, and if that varies at all, it varies by 1-2 tenths of a gc.

So at 3gc per gem a golden parrot should be sold for 225gc on the TO. Anything more than that and you are overcharging, anything less and you are giving a good deal!

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Originally Posted by Falconwolf

Also it should be noted that there is a gc to gem ratio that is pretty much the accepted norm for buying gem items.

The current gc to gem ratio is about 3gc=1gem, and if that varies at all, it varies by 1-2 tenths of a gc.

So at 3gc per gem a golden parrot should be sold for 225gc on the TO. Anything more than that and you are overcharging, anything less and you are giving a good deal!

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Well said.

I just buy the ore, not the deposit, not sure how Zeus is but I buy it regularly for 125gc for 750 ore, then all i have to do is smelt it and save the buffs from harvesting it... a win win.

gold depos went up in price not because of T.O. but because BB finally fixed the double placement exploit.

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Originally Posted by Wujcio

gold depos went up in price not because of T.O. but because BB finally fixed the double placement exploit.

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I disagree completely, but would love to hear your reasoning on this! Would love to hear your reasons why gold depos are in your mind exempt from the standard 3gc to 1 gem ratio!

When it was possible to multi-place deposits (double, triple - depending on your internet connection) we could buy 500 gold deposits in our guild for 125. That was all pure profit for the seller since it was basically free to the player placing the deposit. Once the bug was fixed, and you had to buy them with gems, the price went sky-high. If your gold chain can't make coins at a profit, then shut it down and produce something else. They have given us buffs like Exotic Fruit Basket, Red Flying Settler and just recently the Cookies that last up to two days and triple the output, so that is one way to make a profit without having to pay constant attention to your island.

That's still not a reason for the prices to have gone up.

All you have done is explain how the sellers were...in your own words.... "That was pure profit for the seller"

So if it was pure profit for the seller then, why would it not be pure profit for the seller now?

And more importantly, how does any situation exempt gold depots from the standard 3 to 1 gold to gem ratio?

Edit: You also say they have given us buffs like exotic fruit basket and red flying settlers, but those cost gems. 1 exotic fruit basket is 99 gems...that's 300gc worth just added to the cost of production of your gold ore, thereby garanteeing a huge loss on the purchase of the gold depot. A red flying settler at 199 gems, all by itself cost you more than the gold depot can put out.

Here, to show you just how little sense your comment about buffs we've been given like exotic fruit basket and red flying settlers makes, I redid the calculations using Exotic Fruit Baskets for buffing (and believe me, using Red Flying Settlers only makes it MUCH worse)

If you take a look at the numbers, at best it will cost you 1822gc to produce your gold coins if you use exotic fruit baskets, but that will only give you 1687.5gc, so you are losing about 140gc...and that's the VERY BEST CASE SCENARIO. If you look at all level 1 buildings you end up losing about 3700 gc

So tell me again why gold depos are exempt from the standard 3 to 1 gc to gem ratio?

I use to buy gold depo's and place them and sell them. Then they fixed the bug, and i don't care anymore about it. So your why is it immune to the 3 to 1 gc ratio, cause most people don't really care about that ratio, if you still run lvl 5 gold mines and try to run them 24/7 your going to pay the inflated price or produce something else. I rebuild lvl 1 gold mines now and it at least takes the hastle out of selling marble, tools, hwp and just makes it at a good pace.'

Edit: Most people, people who buy the gems, don't care about that ratio.

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Originally Posted by Tinaras

I use to buy gold depo's and place them and sell them. Then they fixed the bug, and i don't care anymore about it. So your why is it immune to the 3 to 1 gc ratio, cause most people don't really care about that ratio, if you still run lvl 5 gold mines and try to run them 24/7 your going to pay the inflated price or produce something else. I rebuild lvl 1 gold mines now and it at least takes the hastle out of selling marble, tools, hwp and just makes it at a good pace.'

Edit: Most people, people who buy the gems, don't care about that ratio.

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Thats because theyre the ones re-selling the Gems Items, lol. I buy my own Gems and, at one point in time, sold them too. I actually stopped selling Gem Items around the time that the new Trade System was released. Why?? Because the new system is causing players to charge ridiculous prices for Gem Items, and I (being a player with a conscience) have a hard time asking comparable prices for most Items. And when I charge lower prices I just get the same 5 or 6 players buying my stuff and then re-selling them in the TO for the usual high price. Im all for helping other players out, but NOT like that. Im not in the business of making Coins for random players with my hard earned real dollars. Those players arent any better, in my opinion, than the convenience store owners that buy a 24-pack of water at Wal-Mart and then re-sell them individually for $2-3 a bottle in their own store, lol. Is there anything "illegal" about it?? No. Will I help them do it?? Absolutely not.

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Originally Posted by Wujcio

gold depos went up in price not because of T.O. but because BB finally fixed the double placement exploit.

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I agree with this somewhat, but even the loss of double buffing doesnt completely explain the increases we've seen. Imagine if we got the new Trade System, but still had double buffing. Do you honestly think that Parrots would be selling for 150-200 the way they used to?? No, not a chance. Why?? Because BlueByte hasnt given us, as buyers, the ability to negotiate the price at any level. By giving ONLY players that are selling Gold Depos the ability to set the price, B.B. has essentially given them a blank check, that is to be paid out of the buyers pockets. Think about what buying a new car would be like if you weren't able to negotiate with the Dealership. Or better yet, the Dealership knew you couldnt negotiate with them, and they were the only Dealership in town, lol. That is what the Dev's have done to Depo buyers in the Trade Office.

Im not saying that it would be an end to all our problems, but it would definitely bring some sensibility back to the Trade Office.

- VC

It would be ideal if as a buyer you could post the trades for items such as Gold deposits, we can for most other items but there are some that still need to be added or adjusted. The other annoying factor is things like adventures you can only list 1 for purchase or sale. I encourage all those who ask for prices in help channel to use the trade price sheet that Shelleyley & messyjessy have created. The prices on that sheet are fair & similar to what was used before the trade system overhaul but still the gold deposits are high because that is what the market is getting, the only way to moderate the prices is to allow buyers to list the item at the price they are willing to pay as the whole system is horrible with outrageous pricing on almost everything. I refuse to pay the prices that some players list their items & I swear they must be smoking something when they post them. I dumped the gold mines thankfully but I would still like to see the trade system fixed.

First off - its a shame deposits are 1 sided trades. It hurts the buyers.

Secondly - gems are not 3gc per. They are about 4gc per currently. Thus 300gc per deposit is standard.

If you want cheap ore - use and buff lvl 2 gold mines, then destroy and rebuild the suckers.

as for complaining about 24/7 buffs, that is why they have the sleep feature if u know u wont be there for the rebuff. If you have trouble having much uptime at all - well - maybe u should not run gold.

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Originally Posted by Draconus2004

First off - its a shame deposits are 1 sided trades. It hurts the buyers.

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Agreed.

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Originally Posted by Draconus2004

Secondly - gems are not 3gc per. They are about 4gc per currently. Thus 300gc per deposit is standard.

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Only for gold depos....just about every other gem item you can trade is about 3gc per...hence the 3gc=1gem....look up on TO all the gems items being traded and you will see this is true for "most"

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Originally Posted by Draconus2004

If you want cheap ore - use and buff lvl 2 gold mines, then destroy and rebuild the suckers.

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A lot of people I know have stopped buying depos from gem sellers and are destroying and rebuilding their gold mines, which just means that eventually the gem sellers will no longer be making any money off parrots...their own fault!

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Originally Posted by Draconus2004

as for complaining about 24/7 buffs, that is why they have the sleep feature if u know u wont be there for the rebuff. If you have trouble having much uptime at all - well - maybe u should not run gold.

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No one has complained about 24/7 buffs. No one has said you need to keep a building buffed 24/7. In my calculations I used total time a building requires to go through a 500 depot, but nowhere did I say this had to be done 24/7.