PvP is probably better than you think!!!

DISCLAIMER:

On the test server I was only able to raise armies and conquer the tutorial island- but the game freezes prevented me from colonizing. STILL I have been reading the European content - and I have some educated experience as to how PvP will work.

I think it actually makes sense.

(1) ISLAND RESOURCES create new COLONIZING ARMY from hwl, iron bars, steel bars, coal etc. Off they go to conquer.

(2) They conquer and the survivors go home to form your NEXT COLONIZING ARMY.

(3) Apparently you then get Defensive Points to create your Defending army on the conquered island. You use these points to build the various new barracks to house different defensive troops based on your choices and the island's built-in caps. Once you have finished "building your deck"
(Magic the Gathering Fans) - CLAIM the colony - get some safe production for awhile ( your loot for colonizing) and wait to be attacked and see how you do.

(4) If you win or get unnoticed for a while- you keep getting production loot. If you lose…you go home and get your colonizing army ready to go again.

(5) IF I have pieced this together correctly from the Germans - basically the GAME is asking us to direct under utilized resources in the game - to a whole new set of PvP adventures. We are not MEANT to own these colonies forever - nor to use our Home Island resources to defend them

INSTEAD -

we are meant to attack one another over and over and over YAY YAY YAY

To be successful - Your HOME ISLAND simply needs to (1) ramp up production in these underutilized areas and (2) INCREASE YOUR POPULATION!

THAT is how we play TSO. If I am right - I think Im gonna like it.

Strength and Honor!

I'll try them when/if it makes it live. Although i'm not thrilled about 2 seperate armies i need to have for this.

doom, do the rewards seem worth the cost of using the resources? at a glance i didnt think so, but havent looked at it in depth. that will determine whether ppl play it or not

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Originally Posted by psaltery

doom, do the rewards seem worth the cost of using the resources? at a glance i didnt think so, but havent looked at it in depth. that will determine whether ppl play it or not

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Understood. In general - I am pretty contrarian about that philosophy. What else am I gonna do with my resources other than fight? That's why I play the game and build up the island's resources so that I can have a stronger army. All resources are eminently replaceable if the player has built up a strong foundation and population.

Specifically - for PvP - you are right. If the defensive cap restrictions make us easy pushovers on attacks - and/or if the islands don't produce quality loot ( granite! Yay! of course; exotic logs? really ? meh - I don't believe the exotic nurseries are exactly flying off the shelves) then there would be no reason to bother....

But if everyone takes that approach....then....let's you and I go grab a bunch of granite- producing colonies and maybe no one will come after us! woot woot!

I think I will give it a try as well if it looks like the loot is worth it. I'm not big on PVP, but as long as it stays off my home island, I will at least take a look.

Well I did take over many Islands and held them for a little bit. 5 granite an hr did not make it worth the cost of the troops i lost. Not to mention once I placed my defending troops per say on the island it was not better protected then when I took it from the NPC. So it just got took over from someone else. Unless the rewards go up I don't see it being worth it. But I did notice they cut the granite from other normal adventures, I assume this is to force us to do this new type of adventure ( I will not call this PVP)

5 resource/hr isn't a good reward, Artillerist. I got similar payouts. These troops are very costly and time consuming to build. I think the rewards need to be increased then it could be fun to do.

Building a consensus! Let's go BB's! Let's go BB's!

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Originally Posted by Domesday

Let's go BB's! Let's go BB's!

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:) :) :)

that's what i was afraid of. rewards arent worth it, cost is too high, and you can't even defend it once u spend the troops to get it. needs more work.

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Originally Posted by Domesday

Understood. In general - I am pretty contrarian about that philosophy. What else am I gonna do with my resources other than fight? That's why I play the game and build up the island's resources so that I can have a stronger army. All resources are eminently replaceable if the player has built up a strong foundation and population.

Specifically - for PvP - you are right. If the defensive cap restrictions make us easy pushovers on attacks - and/or if the islands don't produce quality loot ( granite! Yay! of course; exotic logs? really ? meh - I don't believe the exotic nurseries are exactly flying off the shelves) then there would be no reason to bother....

But if everyone takes that approach....then....let's you and I go grab a bunch of granite- producing colonies and maybe no one will come after us! woot woot!

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Not a fan of the combat system of this game, if i were to ever think about participating in PvP it would have to be worth it, maybe if we get a resource that is only obtainable through pvp battle and is used to get items that cost only that specific resource- or a limited item reward like- EXPLORER(s), Recycler(s), FLOATER(s), gem pit(s) ;) ? etc...

-His name is RobertPaulson

or make it manditory ....fight or lose star resources!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

no thanks

The problem I find with any game's pvp is that those with bottomless pockets and infinite time will always win. The free players will get slaughtered every time.

The current mechanics don't give any advantage to "rich" folks over free players in terms of either attacking or defending your island. The rules are firm, number of troops is set as well. Once people get some pvp rewards and start putting up towers (bought from those rewards) the island maybe a bit better protected. Than again not sure if it is worth it since you can only keep it for a week and the current 5 resource per 1hr cycle that your island gives is jut not worth the effort and cost.

Granted this, players with gems and established economies will have easier time making the troops needed to do the "pvp". They will do it more often then free players - if they find the rewards worth it. As of know, I don't at all, neither most of testers. Too expensive to run it, to expensive to defend it and not rewarding enough. I agree with people posting on test forums.

2 years ago BB made some effort and post the idea of pvp. There were quite few interesting things in it (espionage building and specific skill tree for generals and such). Not sure what happened with those exciting (a lot of people were really looking forward to see that proposed design in action) ideas. What we got on test is a far cry from what the BB told us about how they see pvp. I think people are wondering what happened to those projects? As always we can only guess they were scraped up to make room for the current "pvp" system. Such a pity. That post 2 years ago got a lot of people interested and excited. This waiting phase ended with the test version which doesn't even look close to what was proposed by devs.

I think the pvp idea is a good one and a compromise between those who want and those who don't want to do it. Still, the rewards are very low compared to the resources and time needed for it. Even I had some fun trying it out, yet I don't think I'd be able to do it or do it often with the amount of resources needed for play it and those low rewards. An improvement on those 2 areas is badly needed for this pvp to be a playable system. It has potential, BB, keep working at improving the rewards and decreasing the resources needed to improve your system.

It was actually pretty nice to see my general Gallop to battle but the rewards incentive vs. the losses incurred was on an order similar to the co-op adventures.
Making combat more grindy may induce a slight rise in gem sales as some players will try using premium coupons to compensate, but once the novelty wears off players will more likely lose interest in the game altogether, IMO...

OK I need to get this off my chest. Looking at it in terms of rewards etc is the wrong way to go about things. Here is the simple economic truth, the game does not have enough resource sinks, and as a result inflation just goes insane till it breaks the economy. We don't need a system that gives us 'better' loot etc we need a system that drains a TON of resources out of the game and as a reward gives some form of 'unique' currency in limited quantities.
The pvp loot should not come close to offsetting our losses from 'defending' the island. What it should do is drop a resource like Grout (I would suggest something different as events would just end up diluting it anyways) that we can use to upgrade buildings past level 5 or after a certain amount buys more island space. This will also encourage participation which will only make it better as well.

The fact that the devs are being short sighted and thinking they will use it to reward with granite will just make it pointless and broken. I want to take an economics textbook and just throw it at you devs!!!

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Originally Posted by LordB

OK I need to get this off my chest. Looking at it in terms of rewards etc is the wrong way to go about things. Here is the simple economic truth, the game does not have enough resource sinks, and as a result inflation just goes insane till it breaks the economy. We don't need a system that gives us 'better' loot etc we need a system that drains a TON of resources out of the game and as a reward gives some form of 'unique' currency in limited quantities.
The pvp loot should not come close to offsetting our losses from 'defending' the island. What it should do is drop a resource like Grout (I would suggest something different as events would just end up diluting it anyways) that we can use to upgrade buildings past level 5 or after a certain amount buys more island space. This will also encourage participation which will only make it better as well.

The fact that the devs are being short sighted and thinking they will use it to reward with granite will just make it pointless and broken. I want to take an economics textbook and just throw it at you devs!!!

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I believe this sums it up very well. PVP for the same ole same ole is just boring. PVP for tokens for a PVP shop, much better idea.

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Originally Posted by Troll-Phu

I'll try them when/if it makes it live. Although i'm not thrilled about 2 seperate armies i need to have for this.

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This is another of my beefs with this 'PvP' system.

And what is with all these non-fighting generals/Marshalls? I will never own one. Imagine a general that is so puzzy that he cannot/will not fight for his dictator, I mean, errr... Aristocrat... Will not get one if they give them away.

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Originally Posted by LordB

OK I need to get this off my chest. Looking at it in terms of rewards etc is the wrong way to go about things. Here is the simple economic truth, the game does not have enough resource sinks, and as a result inflation just goes insane till it breaks the economy. We don't need a system that gives us 'better' loot etc we need a system that drains a TON of resources out of the game and as a reward gives some form of 'unique' currency in limited quantities.
The pvp loot should not come close to offsetting our losses from 'defending' the island. What it should do is drop a resource like Grout (I would suggest something different as events would just end up diluting it anyways) that we can use to upgrade buildings past level 5 or after a certain amount buys more island space. This will also encourage participation which will only make it better as well.

The fact that the devs are being short sighted and thinking they will use it to reward with granite will just make it pointless and broken. I want to take an economics textbook and just throw it at you devs!!!

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Yes exactly. PvP should produce a new research that can be traded on market. Otherwise as LordB stated in the quote, one possibility is it contributes to more inflation. The other possibility is that the resource rewards vs. cost are too low, and the whole system ends up in the dustbin next to wild mary and sons of the veld. I have played it and I don't think the challenge is unique enough, when coupled with the inability to choose which other players you want to combat, to keep people coming back to play PvP for fun for its own sake regardless of cost. So the cost needs to be worthwhile without breaking economy. A new resource would have been perfect for that. Huge opportunity missed, and ultimately huge amount of effort watsed by BB because they continue to ignore well thought out player feedback.

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Originally Posted by LordB

OK I need to get this off my chest. Looking at it in terms of rewards etc is the wrong way to go about things. Here is the simple economic truth, the game does not have enough resource sinks, and as a result inflation just goes insane till it breaks the economy. We don't need a system that gives us 'better' loot etc we need a system that drains a TON of resources out of the game and as a reward gives some form of 'unique' currency in limited quantities.
The pvp loot should not come close to offsetting our losses from 'defending' the island. What it should do is drop a resource like Grout (I would suggest something different as events would just end up diluting it anyways) that we can use to upgrade buildings past level 5 or after a certain amount buys more island space. This will also encourage participation which will only make it better as well.

The fact that the devs are being short sighted and thinking they will use it to reward with granite will just make it pointless and broken. I want to take an economics textbook and just throw it at you devs!!!

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I think this is the best response, I have seen to the issue and would give incentive. You sir have a firm grasp on the mechanics and economy of the game. Inflation is already hitting hard. The grout is a wonderful idea (especially if we can start upgrading storehouses). The additional island space is a ringer. I really hope the Devs take a look at your post. One thing that really irks me is having separate generals/marshals. Would be nice to be able to use our own generals and would be better if we could enhance our generals via skill trees ( I apologize, I digressed from the topic on the last comment).

BB destroyed grout as a "rare" resource during this event... presents are already as low as 10 per and we still have 10 days to go... 10gc for presents mean 3 gc per 1 unit of grout.... so you can stock up with a million of it without much effort....well the biggest effort actually is offloading it from your star. Also lvl6 upgrades take enormous amounts of granite and too little of grout.

They can still add Valor rewards at any time quite easily, which would achieve the same goal as another alternative currency

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Originally Posted by Wujcio

BB destroyed grout as a "rare" resource during this event...

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What...I'm taking donations :P

PVP is far too costly without reward. Far better to do the Fairy Tale Adventures.

Not to mention that having to have 2 armies, and 2 sets of generals is just stupid.