Enemy Camp Destruction Times

[Jason0627]

that is freddie mercury... probably the best vocalist of all time... lead singer of Queen


Drama Queen....

[Lesson]

Interesting thread. Perhaps the server should go down more often.

ZBest,

If you sim your Camp A block for a higher number of iterations, you find that your failer rate is closer to 2.5% (Block only lasting 120 Seconds).

Perhaps you were trying to minimize the number Elites you committed, but if you instead use 63 Elites, you'll find the Block will last the consistant 140 seconds.

Good luck.

-Les_N

[ZBest]

Interesting thread. Perhaps the server should go down more often.

ZBest,

If you sim your Camp A block for a higher number of iterations, you find that your failer rate is closer to 2.5% (Block only lasting 120 Seconds).

Perhaps you were trying to minimize the number Elites you committed, but if you instead use 63 Elites, you'll find the Block will last the consistant 140 seconds.

Good luck.

-Les_N

I was trying to build 3 blocks and a kill on a 160E budget. It survived 2000 sims when I designed it. Once camp A is defined as the worst case -- I could budget some away from camp C to improve it. Still never had a failure.

[Asipak]

Even if the sim could be trusted, which isn't the case, it still tells you that a normal camp could take either 30 or 40 seconds.
That's hardly the same, isn't it?

The destruction times depend on the units, you send to battle. You can find a troop, that destroys a normal camp in 1 round in any cases. If you want to reduce the time, always send cannoneers to battle, because they've got a bonus against buildings. To increase the time, use cavalry only, because they cause the lowest damage to buildings.

I've experimented much to find out the rule to calculate the destruction times and up to now, no one reported a mistake. But I think these times aren't used often at the moment because the most people don't understand how important they are.

[edit]

I've got some values for you:

Possible min. and max. rounds

Building 	Rounds 
	
Bandit camp 	1-2 	
Watchtower 	2-8 	
Reinforced T. 	3-8
Stone tower 	3-16 	 
White castle 	3-16 	 
Witch tower 	3-16  	
Bone church 	3-16 	 
Dark castle 	3-16

[Lamosos]

The destruction times depend on the units, you send to battle. You can find a troop, that destroys a normal camp in 1 round in any cases. If you want to reduce the time, always send cannoneers to battle, because they've got a bonus against buildings. To increase the time, use cavalry only, because they cause the lowest damage to buildings.

Is there any evidence to support this, or are these your personal observations?
Cause this is pretty much exactly the impression I've been getting.
So what you're saying is every building can be considered a separate enemy unit with a specific number of hitpoints that doesn't get attacked until everything else is dead?

I've experimented much to find out the rule to calculate the destruction times and up to now, no one reported a mistake.

Care to share some of that data with us?

But I think these times aren't used often at the moment because the most people don't understand how important they are.

Shame, really.

I've got some values for you:

Possible min. and max. rounds

Building 	Rounds 
	
Bandit camp 	1-2 	
Watchtower 	2-8 	
Reinforced T. 	3-8
Stone tower 	3-16 	 
White castle 	3-16 	 
Witch tower 	3-16  	
Bone church 	3-16 	 
Dark castle 	3-16

That... doesn't really help

[Lamosos]

is it 2^(number of rounds)

are you sayin 2 round dar castle battle will last 2 rounds+bar and bar = 2^2 rounds so its total 6 rounds or 60 seconds, am i doing this right?

No.

[Lamosos]

what is this possible , my attacks are usually 2 or 3 rounds and i never noticed any difference in time on towers or castles

You probably haven't been paying close enough attention or your sample size is too small.
It varies.

or yourefering to when ppl send in 200 recruit to see how long they will last?

People do that? 0_o

[Lesson]

Since i was asked about this recently, and no one else has taken the time to explain how the camp destruction works, I thought I would take a stab at it.

This description was derivied from empirical data I gathered in actual battles and many iterations of Asipak's Sim.

The destruction of a camp is the additional amount of time needed to destroy a camp after you have defeated the enemy that occupied it. It is in addition to the actual battle where you defeated the camp, and is represented by the 'Health Bar' that appears when the inital winning battle is over. The amount of time needed to destroy the camp is calculated the same way as the Battle itself: 20 seconds per round (10 seconds for fast generals like Vet, Grim and BHG). Side Note: This addtional camp destruction time is why it normally is better to have to Winning Advanced Block versus a losing one; Winning in 5 rounds will last just as long as losing in 7 rounds assuming you are not doing something silly like blocking with Cannons.

The number of Rounds it takes to destroy a camp is determined in much the same way as the battle was calculated and is dependent on the camp type and the unit type(s) originally sent to the battle.

The amount of damage a camp can sustain before destruction is as follows (derived emperically):

Building     Damage 
 
 
Bandit camp     250     
Watchtower     1000    
Reinforced T.  1500
Stone tower    2000
White castle   2000
Witch tower    2000
Bone church    2000
Dark castle    2000

Now comes the important part: The amount of damage you can inflict per round is entirely dependent on the unit types represented in the actual battle. At least one of the unit type needs to be alive at the end of the battle to help with the destruction of the building. It also does not matter how many are included to represent; as far as the building destruction is concerned, sending 1 cannon is the same as sending 100, provided at least one is still alive at the end of the fight. You'll see a few examples of this tactic used in some of my guides (mostly Roaring Bull), where I have a mix of unit types being required to take the towers down faster.

[Edit: Whether from a recent change, or a misunderstanding prior, you must have a unit of that type still alive at the end of the battle in order for it to contribute to the camps destruction]

Lesson Guides

So as an example:

Suppose you win a battle using your Vet general against some camp, and you had sent 100R and 150K(Cannons). Assuing at least 1R and 1K are still alive at the end of the battle, for each destruction round you would hit between 255 and 390 in damage based on the following Unit Types that are represented:

Recruit (15-30)
Cannon (120-240) * remember cannons get double the effective damage against buildings
General (120)

So in this case a regular Camp is only going to last 1 round and a Dark Castle or Witch Tower 6-7 rounds depending on your accuracy rolls.

Why is all this important?

If, in this same example you were to replace 3 of those recruits (or cannons) with a Militia, a Soldier and an Elite, suddenly you are hitting for 60-120 additonal damage each round on the building (assuming they all live). Now that Witch Tower will only last 4-5 Rounds.. you just shaved 20 seconds off your potential destruction time so that Advanced Block may work after all!

-Lesson

[Sanii]

Thanks for doing that Lesson, as discussed, I'm sure people interested in this subject will appreciate your efforts, as usual excellent!

Just two comments:

In your table of data, perhaps the second column title should be something like "Hits Reqd For Destruction" instead of "Rounds", if I understand everything correctly. This is just for my clarification of your example that if you had a Vet and his troop combo was a mixture of troop types that had 390 potential hit points per round, that a person can take your Reqd Destruction Hitpoints total and divide by 390 to determine health bar number of rounds for best real time calc of destruction.

ie. for a witch tower, adding Militia, a Soldier and an Elite to the combo adds in a best case hit power of 120 to the destruction so best case 390 + 120 = 510. So from the table (witch tower being 2000), you have 2000 / 510 per destruction round (best case) = 3.92 rounds (round up to 4 rounds). For a Vet attacking would be best case 40 seconds versus NOT having Militia/Soldier/Elite which would be 2000 / 390 which would be (best case) 5.12 rounds (round up to 6 rounds) = 60 secs. So essentially in a best case accuracy roll, as you stated, you've reduced the health bar duration from 60 secs (6 Vet rounds) to 40 secs (4 Vet rounds). You agree on the rounding up of time and this example?

One minor typo as well to mention i think, (265 - 390) in your example should it be 255-390 ?

[Lesson]

Thanks for doing that Lesson, as discussed, I'm sure people interested in this subject will appreciate your efforts, as usual excellent!

Just two comments:

In your table of data, perhaps the second column title should be something like "Hits Reqd For Destruction" instead of "Rounds", if I understand everything correctly. This is just for my clarification of your example that if you had a Vet and his troop combo was a mixture of troop types that had 390 potential hit points per round, that a person can take your Reqd Destruction Hitpoints total and divide by 390 to determine health bar number of rounds for best real time calc of destruction.

ie. for a witch tower, adding Militia, a Soldier and an Elite to the combo adds in a best case hit power of 120 to the destruction so best case 390 + 120 = 510. So from the table (witch tower being 2000), you have 2000 / 510 per destruction round (best case) = 3.92 rounds (round up to 4 rounds). For a Vet attacking would be best case 40 seconds versus NOT having Militia/Soldier/Elite which would be 2000 / 390 which would be (best case) 5.12 rounds (round up to 6 rounds) = 60 secs. So essentially in a best case accuracy roll, as you stated, you've reduced the health bar duration from 60 secs (6 Vet rounds) to 40 secs (4 Vet rounds). You agree on the rounding up of time and this example?

One minor typo as well to mention i think, (265 - 390) in your example should it be 255-390 ?

You are correct, the table heading should read Damage not Rounds. You are also correct that the example should be 255. I'll make those changes.

And you are also correct in the rounding up of the calculations. There are no partial rounds, so if you start the next round, the full amount of time for a round is used. However, since in this example we are talking about using a Vet (Fast general), you can assume this is a Kill attack, not a Block attack, so you want to calculate the worst case scenerio and assume poor accuracy rolls. In this case we are comparing 5 rounds to 7. Same 20 seconds difference in time, but an important distinction.