Player Giveaways and Contests

[TheScientist]

Personal opinion follows, file as appropriate...

I voted for Trade Channel in the ballot, but I wish I'd read the above conversation first. The issue isn't as straightforward as I'd been thinking.

For instance - it isn't as simple as telling traders to use the Ignore function on the givers. I would think the Trader's chief concern is that their offers get nearly zero visibility as they scroll off the top of the page in 2 seconds flat because of all the 'TY's and 'YW's. Those niceties could be done via Whisper, but how do you inform the constant influx of newbies of that convention without clogging trade chat even more? Same with ruling that the niceties are flat-out not welcome. They'll still happen until the newbies are told (over and over) to not do it.

Trivia's are far worse, with the streams of answers and general banter that occurs between questions. Trivia's have no place in the Trade Channel.

Personally - I would classify trivia's and giveaways as 'Contests'. One of knowledge, the other of fortunate timing and quick clicking. I would NOW vote that such 'Contests' be done in Global-1. As stated earlier - changing to a different global channel isn't newbie friendly, and I would think they are the main target audience for the giveaways. Newbies would automatically see them in Global-1.

As for the BB reps and Mods not being on the same page for this stuff... c'mon BB - all it takes is one email from Susu to all Mods.

Trivia was never qualified as a give away :O It's an event. And it doesn't belong in trade chat. About those traders that their offers are lost in the chatter of trade chat they need to try harder. I always dealt with the chatter by posting twice or thrice the same offer later or every 1 or 2 minutes. If they are lazy enough to persist on their offers then they aren't cut off for trading...

[Methius]

I really think it should depend on the type of giveaway you are involved in. I don't mind Mike's giveaways at all. I think they are good for some of the newer players and it is generous of him to consistently give back to the server. I don't think activities like that should be discouraged. I remember enjoying similar giveaways from other players when I was first starting out. But I can understand how the constant chatter in trade becomes an issue for some. When I do giveaways I prefer to treat it just like a regular trade. I'll list bla bla for a fish and then when those are done i'll move on to the next item. If people say thank you during the giveaway I do not respond. Typically that leads to a lot less chatter.(Although I've been accused of being rude because of this) When I am down to the last item i'll make it clear the giveaway is ending and when people say thank you then i'll respond usually once and also thank them for participating. So there is still a slight distraction to trade but a little less so then in other cases.

I think that something like that is still a very appropriate use of trade and is a minimal distraction to the others who are trying to get their trading done. But when you start asking questions and then telling others to post for the winnings you are getting much closer to a trivia contest. And if that's going to be the case then it may be best moved to another global. I don't think that would be too difficult to accomplish. All you would have to do is to post once that are going to be doing a giveaway in global-2 with a quick explanation of how to get there. Then only those who are interested in participating can go and be involved. That really shouldn't be much of a hassle to the one doing the giveaway and wouldn't cause problems with those traders who don't enjoy such things. So basically I think we just need better defintions of what a giveaway is and where you cross the line into something leaning more towards trivia or a sort of giveaway game for prizes. To me a straight up giveaway should be perfectly acceptable in trade while the latter would probably be better served in one of the globals to keep all parties involved content.

[TheScientist]

I really think it should depend on the type of giveaway you are involved in. I don't mind Mike's giveaways at all. I think they are good for some of the newer players and it is generous of him to consistently give back to the server. I don't think activities like that should be discouraged. I remember enjoying similar giveaways from other players when I was first starting out. But I can understand how the constant chatter in trade becomes an issue for some. When I do giveaways I prefer to treat it just like a regular trade. I'll list bla bla for a fish and then when those are done i'll move on to the next item. If people say thank you during the giveaway I do not respond. Typically that leads to a lot less chatter.(Although I've been accused of being rude because of this) When I am down to the last item i'll make it clear the giveaway is ending and when people say thank you then i'll respond usually once and also thank them for participating. So there is still a slight distraction to trade but a little less so then in other cases.

I think that something like that is still a very appropriate use of trade and is a minimal distraction to the others who are trying to get their trading done. But when you start asking questions and then telling others to post for the winnings you are getting much closer to a trivia contest. And if that's going to be the case then it may be best moved to another global. I don't think that would be too difficult to accomplish. All you would have to do is to post once that are going to be doing a giveaway in global-2 with a quick explanation of how to get there. Then only those who are interested in participating can go and be involved. That really shouldn't be much of a hassle to the one doing the giveaway and wouldn't cause problems with those traders who don't enjoy such things. So basically I think we just need better defintions of what a giveaway is and where you cross the line into something leaning more towards trivia or a sort of giveaway game for prizes. To me a straight up giveaway should be perfectly acceptable in trade while the latter would probably be better served in one of the globals to keep all parties involved content.

Well said. We are feeding the fire for no reason. Let's just give it a test period with a few rules/guidelines set and let's discuss this again after a month or so and see how it goes. Don't go about enforcing immediately a plan/guidelines with no testing period. I think we should learn from the mistakes of the past.

A lot of interesting opinions were stated. I hope the mods take them into consideration.

-TS.

[Bushybraw]

As Methius stated, there is a difference between a giveaway and trivia. What is so different about posting "1k copper for 35c in To 4 lots" vs "1k copper for a fish 4 lots". Even if it creates a lot of ty's and yw's doesn't matter much. On the other hand trivia games or different forms of it don't belong in trade. No one wants to see a question posted and 30 people trying to answer it.

[psaltery]

the problem i see with holding trivia in channel 2-30 is not that many people will see the announcement to go to that channel. i've walked into global 1 plenty of times to find there's an impromptu giveaway going on. a single announcement will scroll off fairly quickly. and then u have to explain to new players how to change channels. its just easier to hold it in g-1

[ScriptX]

I agree wish Bushy, I dont understand why it hurts so mutch and why it needs a big discussion.... Be happy people give stuff away for free end of story...

[TheScientist]

the problem i see with holding trivia in channel 2-30 is not that many people will see the announcement to go to that channel. i've walked into global 1 plenty of times to find there's an impromptu giveaway going on. a single announcement will scroll off fairly quickly. and then u have to explain to new players how to change channels. its just easier to hold it in g-1

I normally keep posting every 10-15 mins before I have an event going on and send mail to friends. Tell people that are holding event to announce more frequently where and how they will be holding stuff. Works for me.

[psaltery]

i think your event is great Scientist. on zeus, its more likely that people don't plan it out. they're just bored and decide to give some things away, and come up with trivia questions on the spot. can be 1 question, 5, or more. its quite spontaneous, and i'd hate to see that stifled over rules to change channels.

[Aqua-Dog]

if it's a simple giveaway.. then post anywhere you want but don't be a jerk about it... (we already have rules against people being jerks so no need to explain what this entails)

if it's a trivia/game giveaway... then G-1

all these refinements of rules will just lead to further problems in the future.. When the words are many so are the Misunderstandings.. as long as the 'original purpose' of the rules is not being affected then no need to enforce them... if the 'original purpose' of the rules is being affected.. then enforce them while remembering their humanity (this means - giving them a warning)

the #1 reason I no longer chat or give away things as much as I used to... is because of these 'legalistic' rules that have far strayed from their 'intended' purpose and now are just marching orders for people who can't wait to abuse their new found powers.

Discretion should be the valued word... not Rules

[Wimpy]

I do all my give aways to my guildmates only.