Feedback - PvP & Colonies / new combat system

[Hobknocker]

Zakdorn, think the system through, try again. I have yet to take a colony that doesn't turn a 'profit'. Not saying its great profit. But your example..... just think the system through before trying again.

Why did you put the word profit in quotes? That implies you're changing its definition. What was the intention there?

I haven't had enough coffee to do the math, and I'm not sure I even have the interest to confirm, but I'm thinking that Zakdorn's numbers were somewhat out of whack. However, your statement, "I have yet to take a colony that doesn't turn a profit," (quotes around profit removed - so I'm using the standard definition of rewards being greater than costs), is even more out of whack.

I took a small colony that gave 93 Exotic Logs every 6 hours. I think I kept it for about 4 days before it was taken. That's less than 600 logs. There is no reasonable definition of profit that makes it work. I'll freely confess to using brute force, and maybe could have taken it with less than the 450ish troops I used. But even with Zakdorn's 224 lost troops, the costs of replacing them far outweighs the 600 logs I got out of the expedition.

So I'm back to my question - how can you say you turned a profit on every colony? You've acknowledged that you lost some before the 7 days were up, so you couldn't have maxed the colony's value.

[LordB]

Sure Hob. I hate you for making ME do math this early in the day, where is that calculator and coffee. I want to disclaimer that this isn't going to be exact because I consider buffs so cheap i never factor them into my cost of production anymore. I also don't value coal at the crazy prices it moved at over the last few weeks because of the unprepared.

Lets break it down. Most small colonies (different variations will require different troop expenditure) require about 220 losses AT most/worst. Some I do with about 80.

It costs 20 iron ore, 30 coal to produce 10 iron bars, and then to turn them into steel bars it costs an additional 30 coal. It then costs me about 2550 bars to train the troops required (assuming I am not using the free blockers). Add on another 15000 in coal costs (be generous and consider that a 200 gc cost)

When I take the colony I get rewards, when you lose your colony you also get rewards. My experience with small colonies (I run premium) is that I get a minimum of 3300 iron ore per colony rewards. You also sometimes get nice little bonuses like gold depos, or granite (small I know)

So lets pretend I take a titanium ore colony and only hold it for 2 full days. That will equate into 864 titanium ore. So currently my out of pocket expense is about 200 gc in coal, and an additional loss of maximum 1000 steel bars (after converting the free iron to steel, it is usually much much less). Again giving steel a valuation of 1:1 which I think is too high that means my total 'cost' is 1200 gc. I would trade 1200 gc for 864 titanium ore any day. And that is before you consider I run premium so its really 1296 titanium ore.

Colonies turn profits if you play it right and arn't a muppet. It's just a really bad profit compared to running RB or FT, hence my quotation marks.

[KingHomer]

Sure Hob. I hate you for making ME do math this early in the day, where is that calculator and coffee. I want to disclaimer that this isn't going to be exact because I consider buffs so cheap i never factor them into my cost of production anymore. I also don't value coal at the crazy prices it moved at over the last few weeks because of the unprepared.

Doh! I took a coal colony... so that means my reward is worthless. But at least I get to keep it all week! In fact I have had one for like 12 days now... it stopped producing after 7 days, but since it's worthless coal I can't tell the difference. And periodically someone looks at it and leaves and I get 26 valor points...

[Moonlime]

Doh! I took a coal colony... so that means my reward is worthless. But at least I get to keep it all week! In fact I have had one for like 12 days now... it stopped producing after 7 days, but since it's worthless coal I can't tell the difference. And periodically someone looks at it and leaves and I get 26 valor points...

That could be a good strategy to getting valor points. You may be onto something here

[Hobknocker]

Sure Hob. I hate you for making ME do math this early in the day, where is that calculator and coffee. I want to disclaimer that this isn't going to be exact because I consider buffs so cheap i never factor them into my cost of production anymore. I also don't value coal at the crazy prices it moved at over the last few weeks because of the unprepared.

Lets break it down. Most small colonies (different variations will require different troop expenditure) require about 220 losses AT most/worst. Some I do with about 80.

It costs 20 iron ore, 30 coal to produce 10 iron bars, and then to turn them into steel bars it costs an additional 30 coal. It then costs me about 2550 bars to train the troops required (assuming I am not using the free blockers). Add on another 15000 in coal costs (be generous and consider that a 200 gc cost)

When I take the colony I get rewards, when you lose your colony you also get rewards. My experience with small colonies (I run premium) is that I get a minimum of 3300 iron ore per colony rewards. You also sometimes get nice little bonuses like gold depos, or granite (small I know)

So lets pretend I take a titanium ore colony and only hold it for 2 full days. That will equate into 864 titanium ore. So currently my out of pocket expense is about 200 gc in coal, and an additional loss of maximum 1000 steel bars (after converting the free iron to steel, it is usually much much less). Again giving steel a valuation of 1:1 which I think is too high that means my total 'cost' is 1200 gc. I would trade 1200 gc for 864 titanium ore any day. And that is before you consider I run premium so its really 1296 titanium ore.

Colonies turn profits if you play it right and arn't a muppet. It's just a really bad profit compared to running RB or FT, hence my quotation marks.

Sounds like you're just using Attack Infantry at every defensive camp, and there I was, mixing up my troops, using ones that were "optimized" for the defenders.

Clearly, I'm the muppet.

[LordB]

Clearly, I'm the muppet.

I still think you are swell. But yea. The only way cav/bowmen should be used is if troop losses become your limiting factor. So situationally they can be required for large colonies, but never small. Cav can be used if you are too lazy to send a double general or need to do a triple block though.

[LuckyLohr]

tried the new pvp and don't care for it at all. Please at least give us a way to bomb the buildings and get our space and licenses back for them! Having 4 garrisons and the armory and barracks...that I will not be using is a lot of wasted space and licenses!

[Moonlime]

you could always use the tool to remove building found in the building menu, but might you want to try again before you do that to be sure?

[Pinkleet]

I think "bombing" them is much more in line with the sentiment about pvp than removing them.

[ursul71]

Me and my guildmates have been happily playing this game for years. You work together to complete goals and help smaller players to move ahead. Meanwhile you can develop your own island with production chains and decorations. And you invite friends and family to come play too.

Most of the online games are competitive and require players to be mean to each other by stealing resources or territory, TSO is not like that at all. This game stands out from other online games in that it is 'cooperative' and not 'competitive'.

Introducing PvP and changing the production chains in TSO are 2 mayor mistakes. Players are here because this is a peaceful feelgood game and changing everybody's production chains overnight is just rude and against the spirit of the game. Changing the rules during the match is not fair to players who have been loyally building and playing for years. For that reason many players (including moi) are considering going to another game. I hope the changes can be reversed.

If BB wants to offer a competitive game they can include PvP in a new game like ANNO or a new Settlers-server. If they want to 'improve' the game they can just introduce a new building or character in the game now and then, more is not needed to keep everybody happy

Don't try to fix something that aint broken, you might break it.