Why does interception work different in PvP

[Artillerist]

So I have a few questions.
1 why do you let camps from different zones intercept generals ( does not happen in regular)
2 Why do you have the camps numbered with interception order if unlike regular adventures generals who are intercepted and traveling to attack the interception camp, If they walk in some new red zone will be intercepted by this new camp. Its kind of like playing ping pong. making it impossible to plan attack other then just throw everything and see what happens. with the faster walking speed recall is almost useless


Edit. Well some of the above may be due to the leaders and borders messed up. After killing a leader and moving my generals i say I could move generals into a zone thats not cleared. Then looking closer the zone has no leader but one of the other zones has 2 leaders.





This is a level 3 huge rich Island ( Granite)

[Perwyn]

Ping pong is an apt description of what happens when you get spit out of the 1st intercepting camp after victory and bounced into some new interception instead of going on to the target camp. HUH??? Multiple interceptions can ruin the best laid plans, that's for sure.

The one that chaps my lips is the camp from another zone intercepting an attack on a leader, especially since it doesn't highlight in the numbered aggro zones. Oh well, this is what makes this fun and challenging right? And now I know to be on the lookout for that particularly nasty surprise.
Edit: Having recently done the same map again (was I taking my island back?!?! IDK?) I realize that the aggro zones were actually highlighted, in my rush to make fast time I missed that minor detail and it bit me hard. Haste makes waste for real. /Edit

Given the generals speed a pause button would make sense so that a retreat would be doable.

Pretty funny about 2 leaders in one zone and none in the other!! In looking at the report from an island of mine that was taken, I couldn't understand how the attacker did what he/she did to take out 2 of the leaders. Now I think I do. Something else to watch out for.

I imagine when adventures 1st came out they were even more buggy than what we're dealing with. I feel good when I can still finish in spite of the mishaps, dead marshals and running low on a particular troop type. Quitting is not an option!!

[Plumz]

It's o right 2025 is just around the corner and by then "pvp" will work like well oiled ...whatever..

[Perwyn]

That's what everybody loves about you Plumz.... your infectious optimism!

[Pinkleet]

Lets face it, we are playing a beta game that is being improved on live servers. The test server is just for show (as many testers already figured out). Everything happens on life. I got used it already. Also that is a reason why TSO will never go to pay per month model. IT IS A BETA version, not a released game...

[Aurboth]

1 why do you let camps from different zones intercept generals ( does not happen in regular)

This does happen in other adventures. The first that comes to mind is in Sons of the Veldt, where you are required to block an overlapping camp in the next leader zone. From the Killste group, this attack sequence is required to prevent intercept by the camp on the other side of the zone markers.



This can also happen at the end of Bandit's nest, where your general can be intercepted by a camp in the target zone while he is still in a controlled zone. It is not a change from current adventures, just demonstrated more due to the difficulty of the maps.

2 Why do you have the camps numbered with interception order if unlike regular adventures generals who are intercepted and traveling to attack the interception camp, If they walk in some new red zone will be intercepted by this new camp. Its kind of like playing ping pong. making it impossible to plan attack other then just throw everything and see what happens. with the faster walking speed recall is almost useless

The numbers for intercept are present in the normal adventures as well; they were both added at the same time. Players can leave one intercept camp and be intercepted by one or more other camps before reaching their target. Examples of this is the initial attack on the east side of Stealing from the Rich, where you can't clear multiple camps with a single attack, because a trap/wolf pack will cause an intercept if the general does not return after the first attack; although you can attack from the same place and avoid the trap/wolf pack and hit the next camp without intercept. It is also commonly seen in the fast cannon version for Island of the Pirates, where the attacking general is intercepted from camp to camp before hitting the leader, and also is able to bypass a camp because of a favorable intercept order in the last section. It is also a feature with the last attack on Nords, where the leader camp does intercept and allow the player to bypass two of the three guarding camps. In contrast, where the leader camp does not have an intercept zone, you will see a double intercept, as in Stealing from the Rich, when you can be detoured by two guarding archer towers attempting to attack one of the central white castles.

The primary difference with the Expedition maps comes in two parts. First, people have not handed out maps where the intercept zones have been analyzed and routes predetermined. The same would be true for players who started an adventure without any guide or attacking information. Second, not only are the maps randomized, preventing maps from being made, but the increased density of camp placement makes certain areas more difficult to analyze on the fly.

[Perwyn]

Nice analysis Aurboth. And now that you point it out, yes, we can get multiple intercepts on a few maps. The speed of the marshals is what aggravates the situation since there's not enough time to react. By the time you hear the sound, see the notice and realize you've been intercepted the battle's already started. Guess it's a trade off, I love how fast the marshals are compared to adventure generals. But there should be an alternative to them shooting from one camp to the next like a pinball. Plumz will figure it out, I just know it!

[Artillerist]

let me try and explain the ping pong comment better. I send him at camp 1 knowing it will hit the red zone of camp 2. I hear the intercept sound which is what I want. Then before camp 2 is engaged the general walks into camp 3 and is pulled from camp 2 and actual walks right past him. So here he is heading to camp 3 still yet to actually engage anyone. and he walks into camp 4s red zone pulling him back to it. It was very strange.

As for the camps for other zones I guess in some maps in regular it happened as well. I just know some fights where you enter the red of a different zones camp it never pulled you in. As well as in these maps camps are allot closer together so we see it more

[Ceruhe]

Uh, how to start.

1) As it has been pointed out, does happen in regular adventures as well, was thinking when clearing your island in S3, as there is a camp in S6 that might pull you if you weren't following a guide for placement. Other than that, first camp to intercept is the one that gets primary attention, aka I _have_ been seeing if I can gets intercepted from a mountain rage into another sector to make some madness block, but so far on Small Tier 1 that doesn't seem to be the case anywhere.

Though a slight difference from regular adventures does happen. One of which I think isn't really intended and one that seems reasonable either way, but meh.
The intended one being that an aggro zone pulls you from your own territory, unlike regular adventures (if you pull up Outlaws, the first 3 camps in the middle path, you can actually attack them in any order, due to entering each aggro zone in your own territory and therefore get treated as "he was aiming for me and entered my aggro zone, therefore you guys cannot intercept).

The unintended one, at least how I'm seeing it, that Marshalls jumps some ~3 flags upon getting intercepted. That is somewhat of an issue to not forget when doing blocks, but this can be counter balanaced with a few more heavies to offset the time, as I wouldn't really move the camps according to the jump, because if that gets fixed down the road....bad surprise to be had.

Lastly, though I'm missing a good example now I think, but wanna go with the same Outlaws example...
Image you are on Outlaws, the 3 camps towards the center path. Take out the first one. That leaves you with the 2 camps side by side with the same aggro range... (not not really sure, but just imagaine the scenario then...), your Marshall enters "in the middle" of both camps, aka where they are overlapping. Assuming you are targeting the Leader far behind them, I wouldn't know which of these 2 camps would get intercept priority. I'm not fully trusting the numbering as I've seen mislables in regular adventures already (iirc was an FT, but cannot recall the exact situation).
I had a similar thing in an Expedition as well, but I was aiming for 1 of the 2 intercepters, which follows the same rule of "you entered both aggro zones at the same time, but one of them is your actual target, so you get to fight the one you picked" without the other camp intercepting.

And if there is something I'm actually sad about with intercepting and pathing and so forth...it's the massive amount of space to place and space your Marshalls, but alot of valid space isn't allowing you to place your Marshall in said location, or even the Suppliers. Boggles me how you have this visually perfect area to work with, but practically it's invisible trees everywhere.


2) Having read that again, it looks like what I just also included in 1) doesn't seem to happen to you, or I haven't actually haven't had the verify on my own yet. I'll try to recreate it on my next expedition and report back, but I'm not denying that I actually was going with the assumption that 1st camp to intercept,regardless from where, is the one you get to fight without being able to get intercepted again. Or we are actually talking about 2 very similiar but big differences...anyhow, I'll try to verify both of my setups I have in mind and will report back in details once I can recreate the situation(s).

Second, not only are the maps randomized, preventing maps from being made, but the increased density of camp placement makes certain areas more difficult to analyze on the fly.

Although they are randomnized, they do have a set pattern (let's just go with 5, at least that's matches my small T1 colony runs, haven't touched a regular/huge one yet where it's likely to be more). Making a guide as we know it is therefore not possible, but if you start with your landing zone, you "simply" would have to pick the "tile" you are seeing and adjust the blocking units accordingly to what the camps are, which can be simmed. Or rather, get the hang of the timing. I for one am not digging the "1 flag = 1 round assumption", as I mostly obverse dmg number exchange every 2 flags or so...also need to get into understanding that fully and then "everything can be adjusted with numbers alone".

Whoever has made guides before knows how important the flag times are to a (sophisticated) block. Luckily we don't have to worry so much about block duration as we can pretty much pick our desired times. Which in turn means flag times are irrelevant, but that causes waste that we obviously want to reduce, the gain still not justified for the amount you have to spend.

[Perwyn]

I get the ping pong reference. Even with the numbered aggro zones there doesn't seem to be a working hierarchy to the intercepts. Altho I see it more like a pinball machine myself.

Ceruhe's Outlaws example is a perfect illustration of what we're accustomed to. The camps he references in his example are right on top of each other and there's no ping pong/pinball/bounce between camps like we're getting in expeditions. It's like there's not enough time for an aggro zone to lock onto the marshal. Being that we're routed thru a multitude of servers and back again with every mouse click I seriously wonder if a marshals walking speed was slowed down to general speed if the problem would disappear completely.